Apply to be a Moonwalker

From Earth orbit to the Moon and Mars, explore the world of human spaceflight with NASA each week on the official podcast of the Johnson Space Center in Houston, Texas. Listen to in-depth conversations with the astronauts, scientists and engineers who make it possible.

On episode 445, NASA astronaut Nichole Stilwell and Acting Human Resources Director Tamsin Abotteen discuss the astronaut application process and what it takes to join NASA's next class of explorers. This episode was recorded on October 20, 2026.

Transcript

Gary Jordan

Houston We Have a Podcast. Welcome to the official podcast of the NASA Johnson Space Center, episode 445: Apply to Be a Moonwalker. I'm Gary Jordan, and I'll be your host today. On this podcast, we bring in the experts, scientists, engineers, and astronauts, all to let you know what's going on in the world of human spaceflight and more.

Ask any astronaut; they'll tell you that one of the most common questions that they get is, "How do I become an astronaut?" We're getting them too in our Houston We Have a Podcast mailbox, Paul and Eric recently asked this very question. We're lucky that we've had the chance to speak with many of these astronauts through the years on this podcast, and we've heard many different answers to that very question. The reality is, there's no one straight line to get there, and thankfully for those that are on that path, whatever it may be, the chance to join the ranks and become a NASA astronaut is happening right now.

Through December 3rd, 2026, NASA will be accepting applications for its newest class of astronauts. But where can you apply? What will you be doing? And where will you be going? There have been a few updates since the last go around, and it can be a little overwhelming to unpack it all. So we thought we'd bring in the experts, those who know the job and the process.

Joining us on this episode is NASA astronaut Nichole "Vapor" Stillwell and Acting Human Resources Director Tamsin Abotteen. Between Vapor, a recently flown veteran astronaut of Crew-10 and Expeditions 72 and 73, and Abotteen, knowing the ins and outs of the application process, you'll hopefully become somewhat of an expert yourself on the astronaut application process, and maybe hear a few fun stories along the way.

Dust off those resumes and pay attention. Astronauts selected from this application are destined for new and bold things, flying new spacecraft, testing new capabilities, and walking on the surface of the Moon.

Let's get started.

Nichole and Tamsin, thank you very much for coming on Houston We Have a Podcast. What an exciting time! You get to apply to be an astronaut. I can't wait to get in it, learn all the ins and outs of it, and it should be a really really fun episode.

Nichole, welcome back. This is you're returning to Houston We Have a Podcast. It's been, and I looked, it's been two and a half yearssince we've had you on. I feel like you've done a couple of things since then. Maybe a mission to space and everything. But tell us real quick, what have you been up to since we last talked with you?

Nichole Stilwell

Yeah, thanks for having me. I'm excited to be back.

To your point, was a pilot on Crew-10, so NASA's SpaceX Crew-10 mission. Spent about five months in space. Did a spacewalk. Came home, recovered from that. Learned how to walk again and reintegrate back into home life. And then been really busy, actually. You know, hit the ground running, so to speak, when I came back to work officially. So, I've been the mentor and lead instructor for our recent class of astronauts going through their spacewalk training.

Gary Jordan

Excellent.

Nichole Stilwell

Yeah, which is exciting. So exciting to to sit here and talk about the next class. I'm going to be an Artemis III Capcom as well. So I've been learning everything I possibly can about Artemis and Orion and talking to the crew and working at Mission Control. And then, actually, I'm going to be the ground IV for the upcoming spacewalks at the end of October, early November. So, working with that team, and I'm going to be working with one of my classmates and Josh Kutryk while they go upgrade the power system on the International Space Station.

Gary Jordan

They keep you busy. They don't let you do just one thing, huh? Well, cool. Welcome back. Thank you. It's gonna. It's a pleasure to have you.

Tamsin. Welcome to the podcast. Your very first time. Tell us a little bit about your yourself growing up, how you got to NASA, and what you do for us.

Tamsin Abotteen

Thank you so much. I'm really excited to be here. This is my first time on the podcast, but I've been a part of NASA for a really long time. I can't believe it. It's gone by so quickly.

I have been with NASA for about 18 years now. In my current role, I am getting to perform one of the most exciting ones I've had yet, which is I'm the acting HR director here for Johnson Space Center. I've been doing that for about six, six to nine months now. I've been well ingrained in JSC's HR office for quite some time, but I have to say this has been the most exciting. I do come from a small town in East Texas, Longview, Texas. Shout out to them, and made myself to Houston after college. And before coming to NASA, I worked in a consulting firm where I got a lot of experience in testing and assessments and HR selection tools. So as I look ahead at this this position I'm moving into for the selection cycle, I think there's a lot of fit there even then.

Gary Jordan

So yeah, the position is the are you like the chief selection officer or yeah yes, and so

Tamsin Abotteen

along with my HR director role, I will be performing the ASCAN selection manager role, which I'm so excited about.

Gary Jordan

Two easy hats, you know. Absolutely. Yeah.

Tamsin Abotteen

We are so busy. I think Nichole has said that a few times. Very busy, and that's because of a lot of the great work that we have going on here. Whether it's the work up at station that we have our astronauts doing, or if it's the work that you know this amazing stuff we've been doing with Artemis. You know, we had Artemis II success this past year. We look ahead at Artemis III. We've got some busy things ahead of us, and I know we've got the best talent to make that happen.

Gary Jordan

Absolutely. There's a lot that you guys are doing, both in the astronaut office as well as HR. Definitely appreciate you both being here. This is a very busy time, and I get to carve out some time into your schedule. With that, let's get right into it. I want to start by diving in right into the nitty gritty.

I think the exciting part, the reason why we're getting here today is because applications are open to apply to be an astronaut. Like you said, it's a very exciting time. But I want to just get into the application process first. I think people are really interested in exactly okay, yes, I want to be an astronaut. Now we're going to talk about exactly what that means. Nichole, pulling from your experiences, and what we're going to be doing in the future. But really getting down into the weeds. If somebody right now wanted to hop online and and apply to be an astronaut, what can they expect to do?

Tamsin Abotteen

Okay, yeah, I'm happy to start with the basics. I am excited that we're going to be jumping in into another cycle. I can't believe it. It was just this time, probably last year, that we were announcing our last class, and so usually that's a process that we take at least a few years in between. But because of all the stuff we have going on across NASA, it's time to keep that pipeline really filled.

And so, for those that are interested in applying, you will do exactly like you would if you were to apply to any regular job for NASA. You go to usajobs.gov, or you can just put into your search browser USA Jobs, and that will take you to a search browser where you can type in "astronaut" or "astronaut candidate," and that is where you will see the job announcement posting.

It is lengthy, so make sure that you take the time to read through it and find detail. But some of the basics of the announcement from last cycle have not changed. Some of those just basic requirements around the U.S. citizenship is still the same. We also have some education requirements that are also the same of making sure you have a master's degree in a STEM-related field, or that you are currently completing or enrolled in a test pilot school as well. And then we also have some other basic requirements. Three years of relevant experience must be displayed on your resume or CV that you apply to. And then we also have a basic questionnaire that we ask all applicants to complete as well, just to make sure that you can complete the basic duties that an astronaut must must do once they come on board.

Gary Jordan

Basic. I'm putting this in quotations. It's unbelievable what these- Yeah, of course. There's a couple things that are different too, right? Yeah.

Tamsin Abotteen

Yes, and so in general, we have kept the process pretty much the same, but we have been tweaking some of the qualifications here and there. For example, whenever applicants apply, they will have to opt into a particular discipline group. We have seven different discipline groups that you have to choose from. Some applicants might find that they might qualify for more than one of those discipline groups, but we ask you to apply to specifically one. That can span anywhere from an engineering discipline group, an operations discipline group, medical, a physical scientist, a pilot, test pilot, as well.

And one of the differences from last cycle is just that we have separated out the engineering and operations discipline previously that was combined. So we've decided to separate those out just to give us a little bit more granularity into the types of experience that those in the operations field might be able to bring to the table that is different than the engineering field.

In addition, you will also find that we've made some tweaks to the pilot discipline, specifically previously in our past announcement, I think you had to have around 750 hours in a high performance jet. This year, we have expanded that aperture a bit to include not just high performance jet, but also some opportunity for that pilot discipline to also include different types of pilot experience.

I'm not sure if Nichole, you want to touch on some of those.

Nichole Stilwell

Yeah, yeah. So in the past, you know, we've had high performance jet pilots that we look at in the pilot category, and then anyone else with flight experience actually has to apply in flight test or engineering. And so we just wanted to be a little bit more transparent about pilots are going to apply as pilots, whether you're high performance jet, whether you fly, you know, bigger winged aircraft, fixed wing aircraft. Whether you're a rotor wing pilot, so we're we're going to actually just put everybody in that pilot category and compare pilots to pilots.

And you know that comes from as we try to get to the Moon, we are looking at vertical takeoff and landing, and we have just started flying helicopters here at Ellington. And so we we're looking at crewed aircraft and how how are you going to get to the Moon? Right, it's in a crewed vehicle, and how are we going to land on the Moon? So we wanted to be a little bit more transparent and actually look at pilots and their experience.

Gary Jordan

Fantastic, yeah. You're alluding to some of the rationale behind why we are kind of expanding that that, and you know why we're doing it now and why we're expanding exactly that skill set. Very, very exciting. We're trying to bring on. It's going to be a pretty exciting class that we ultimately bring on.

Nichole, I wonder if this is jogging any memories for you. You know, in terms of, you know, we're talking about the application process. You know, like, are you, you know, recalling you going to USA Jobs and thinking, am I going to apply? You know, how to beef up your resume to really stand out, which is which is funny because we're talking about, you know, like the basic requirements and everything, and Nichole is over here flying F-22s. So, so yeah, tell us tell us a little bit about you know what do you recall from that experience?

Nichole Stilwell

Yeah, you know, I was really nervous actually, when I applied. I barely met the minimum requirements when I applied. We were, we required actually 1000 hours in a high performance jet, and I had 1000 and like 12 hours when I applied. So I just barely made the cut.

I have a unique background because I flew a lot. I, you know, flew a lot of combat missions, so I ended up with much more time in aircraft than my peers, and so I was just barely eligible. So, a lot of nerves. You know, I'm also not a test pilot, and generally we've hired test pilots in the past, and so, you know, I was like, I don't, I don't even know if they'll look at me when I applied. But I, I met the bare minimum, so I was like, you know what, I'll try. And and you know, obviously, we're going to talk about how I got here.

But yeah, I think I was shocked when I got the interview call. I was shocked when I got the phone call. All of that. And I think that's true for a lot of people. You know, they they don't know if they're going to be eligible. They don't know if that you know if I meet the bare minimum, is that good enough? And yes, I think it is.

Gary Jordan

I mean, aside from there's the there's the bare minimum of the flight hours, you know, and of course that, but that's like a minimum requirement, you know. So thinking about the minimum requirement and thinking about how do I stand up because I'm not a test pilot? Is there anything that you put into your resume to really try to emphasize, like?

Nichole Stilwell

You know, I think every resume that we're going to read, you know, the 1000s of resumes that we're going to read, everybody is qualified, right? Everybody is a rock star, and everybody is motivated. They're educated. They they're you know the top of their field. That's that's what we pick from for NASA astronauts. And so, I actually think it's the small things that stand out on an application, you know, I tried to highlight some of the more extracurricular things or hobbies, or you know, I did a lot of public outreach just as an Air Force officer, and so I tried to highlight a few of those things.

But I would say there's no one recipe for a resume, right? It's just what stands out about you, what's unique about you. We want to get to know you aside from just that rock star resume that you're going to put together.

Gary Jordan

Yeah, I was going back and listening to some old podcasts that we did with you, Nichole. You said beautifully about really just pursuing what you loved, right? You said through every phase, you know, I want I was big into flying. I wanted to fly, so I did that, and I loved that. And then I did this, and I loved that. And through every stage, you sort of loved what you did. You know, it wasn't like astronauts the ultimate goal, and everything before that. I'm going to be sad until I'm an astronaut, right? You just love every stage of it, and I do think that's really important. You got to find those passionate people.

Nichole Stilwell

Yeah, I think that's one of the biggest things that that we look for, right? And that's you know when little kids ask me like, "How do you be an astronaut?" Like you have to find what you're passionate about. You know, you got to find what you love and go get really good at that because we're looking for the people that are really good at what they do. And you know, I was very happy in my job. I would have been happy even if I hadn't got the astronaut job, right? And so I think that's another important piece of this is that you do what you're passionate about because ultimately, being selected as an astronaut is a really small percentage, and you want to be happy if you don't. And so, I think I encourage people- find the things you you love to do, work hard at it, be a good team player, and you you will really get anywhere you want in your life.

Gary Jordan

And I did want to emphasize that, Tamsin, Nichole alluded to it a few times, but this is not a very small applicant pool that you guys are going to be sifting through. Historically thousands, sometimes exceeding tens of thousands, right? So this is a lot of work to sift through these resumes and truly like and confidently pick out the best of the best, the best in their respective fields. So at a certain point, you know the applications are closed, and then you guys have to hit the ground running. What's your what's your approach to sifting through thousands of resumes?

Tamsin Abotteen

Yes, we're going to have a lot on our plate. That being said, we want to make sure that we do it in a timely manner. It is a longer process than a normal job application process that we would traditionally have. That being said, we want to make sure we do that in a thorough manner, and so we have lots of stakeholders and lots of players that play a piece in making that happen.

So once we have our announcement close, we actually partner with OPM, Office of Personnel Management, and we have created this partnership with them so that we can get some help from their staffing experts to be able to essentially cull through all of those applications. Previous selection cycles we have had anywhere upwards of 8000, 12,000, 18,000 applications! And so, to be able to make sure that we can get to a manageable, a more manageable place, we really do leverage and partner with those experts to make that happen.

And so they will go through every single resume application one by one, seeing what the applications say to ensure that each of those applicants meet those minimum qualifications that we've outlined: the education, the specialized experience, and make sure that they have the appropriate documentation to show that. Once they get that list down to those that they deem as qualified, then they will pass those back to NASA, and so that's where our team comes into play with the astronaut office. The astronaut office plays a very heavy role in making sure that they review all of those qualified applicants by discipline group, and those discipline groups come together to determine how our applicants are either then qualified versus highly qualified, and from there, that helps us narrow that that applicant pool even further through that review process. And yes, yeah, we can talk a little bit more about what that looks like too.

Gary Jordan

Yeah, absolutely. That's going to be so. So Nichole, are you going to be as part of that committee, or is maybe someone else in the in the astronaut? It sounds like you guys are going to be working together.

Nichole Stilwell

Yes, definitely, and we are going to enlist the help of every single astronaut that is on Earth and available. So after OPM looks at them and they figure out who is qualified, then astronauts read every single resume and every single application, and we are the ones who we break into panels. So you know, as a pilot, I'll be looking at the pilot applications, and the engineers will look at the eng- so we can speak their language, read the resume, and understand what they what they're trying to convey to us about their experience.

But yeah, we put eyes on every single application. You know, we take it very seriously in our office. Aside from training for and going to space and supporting the families of those in space, hiring our next class is the most important thing that we do.

Gary Jordan

Absolutely! Wow. So you guys have a long road ahead of you. Is it is it really just one long sprint, or you kind of have to take breaks in between to do your day jobs? Right. Unbelievable.

Nichole Stilwell

I'm not sure exactly what the structure is going to look like this this time around, but yeah, I think you know I think there might be some sprints in there. And especially as we try to get down to the interview groups, you know, there's a lot to be done in that initial few weeks as we're looking at all those resumes.

Gary Jordan

That's right. So so you got to weed out some who meet the minimum requirements, and then you get those qualified, highly qualified, right? And now you get to the interviews, right? Now you're bringing people on. You really want to see these folks in person. A resume that has gone through several, several rounds and been looked at a couple of times to say, "Is this a person I want to bring on?"

That's a that's a pretty finite group, right? It's like I think historically it's been like 50 or something like that. It's down from 18,000, or you know, eight to 18,000. That's that's small.

Tamsin Abotteen

Absolutely, absolutely. Usually, for the interview group, we try to shoot for around 100, 120 individuals before we get to that that next phase. And so we do try to bring in as many people as possible to really get eyes on those applicants. Because we are, to Nichole's point, we are investing so much in these individuals once they do come on board as astronaut candidates. We spend two years of training for to get them ready to be able to step aboard to to fly to space. And so with that investment, we want to make sure that we have as many people touching the applications as we can that are subject matter experts, as well as getting eyes on those applicants through the interview process.

And so, through that process, once we have them come in for interviews, we will also start to bring in our behavioral health and medical teams as well to be able to get even a further view and perspective on our applicants from various different different standpoints. We've talked a lot about the technical qualifications, but during the interview portion, during some of the testing and some of the assessments that we're going to be doing, we're also going to be evaluating our applicants on other types of competencies of how they will interact and engage as teammates and team members. And that's just as I would say equally as important as their technical qualifications too.

Gary Jordan

Well, yeah, I'm jumping ahead a little bit, but Nichole, thinking about this idea of a class. I mean, traditionally you're part of the Flies, and then before that was the Turtles, and you know we have a new class coming up. Have they been named yet? I forget…

Nichole Stilwell

The Platypi!

Gary Jordan

The Plat- That's right. The platypi. I remember going back and forth on what what's the plural of platypus. I remember that one. So so, but but how they gel together, not only as a class but really as as part of the corps. Right. Ultimately, you guys have to work together. Hugely important. We've talked about it a lot on this podcast. You've experienced it yourself. You guys are super close, the Flies.

Nichole Stilwell

Yeah, we are. You know, I think each class is you know close because we go through that initial training. It's two years of initial. It's some of the most grueling and challenging training that some of us will ever go through. There's a lot of travel. There's a lot of physical challenges, and the only way you get through it is together as a team. And so I think that yeah, the bond that you build in ASCAN training is is huge, and you take that onto your mission and with your crew, you know, on space station or on Artemis and onto the Moon. So those relationships are hugely important.

Gary Jordan

Are these people going to work together to be successful on a mission to space in a tin can? Right. So very, very important thing to really consider. I want to go back to the interview process. And then jump over. We talked about the inner the inner workings of the interview process, but Nichole, jumping back over to you to once again walk down memory lane of your experience on the other side, like actually receiving the phone call. Hey, Nichole, we really want to interview you again. Nichole, we want to bring you on site. You know, talk about those moments and passing those milestones and be like, oh wow, maybe I do stand a chance.

Nichole Stilwell

Oh man! You know, like I said, thousands of people apply. The chances of getting picked are really slim. You know, when I found out, I even got a little bit of wind that my references had been pulled. I was like, "Woo! I can die happy!" I made it into the top several hundred, right?

Gary Jordan

Yeah.

Nichole Stilwell

And then I got the phone call for the first round of interviews, which is at 120 or so, and I was like, "Wow, now I can really die happy! Like, I'm glad I'm just gonna go down to Houston and hang out for a few days."

Gary Jordan

Yeah.

Nichole Stilwell

You know, and then we do the we did the final round or the second round, which is you know we I think for our class they did 40 in that final round, and so I was like, "Oh my gosh, I made it made it to the top 40!" Like, "good, I'm good, I'm happy for life."

Yeah, so you know we I was in Alaska at the time, so I flew down a day early because of the time change and the travel time. So I met Denise Burnham actually on that first flight, because she was in Alaska as well, so one of my first intros to you know someone that then I worked really closely with over the last four and a half years or so. But you know one of my favorite memories of this, you end up working out with some of the current astronauts, and Christina Koch of all people was in my group, and you know she just came off of like this insane trail run the weekend prior, and you know, and I'm dying in this workout. And I was like, I told them I work out, told them I'm in shape. I gotta keep up with her. No way, not gonna happen. Like there is no way that you keep up with Christina Koch when you're working out. But you know, it's just one of those moments where you get to know some of the current astronauts and you get to hang out with them. And again, like as an interview process, we're still looking at the candidates, and you know it's all about your attitude at that point. You know nobody's going to survive that workout, but it's really up to up to you to just kind of grind through it and be a good team player. And so I remember like trying to give her a high five and not pass out. You know, and so those are those are some of my favorite memories of of hanging out with the astronauts getting to know them, but also, you know, we're gonna put we're gonna put you guys under some stress. We're gonna put the candidates under some stress. We're gonna, you know, the interview alone is stressful. You've got a whole group of people that you know and you admire that are asking you questions, and some are gonna be tough.

Gary Jordan

Amazing, yeah, that's got to be absolutely. So, Tamsin, are you guys are you with the astronaut office through every step of this process? You know, all the way, even all the way through the phone call?

Tamsin Abotteen

As long as they will let me be there, it has been such an amazing experience already. Just getting to prepare for this process, and so the thought of getting to walk through each phase of that and what it looks like to be able to get to the the final 40 and even less than that, and be able to make those phone calls is something that is just incredibly life changing for me, and I'm not even the one getting the phone call! Just because you are getting to work with such exceptional people through the process and get to know the best of what this country has to offer in regards to just the capabilities that you get to see on paper, but then in person, and then get to meet and engage with them. Just really looking forward to the process.

Nichole Stilwell

that final phone call, man, that's that's a core memory for me.

So actually, I was so I was in Florida with my twin sister and her family. We went to Disney World, and then we were driving back. They lived in South Carolina at the time, and so we had enough people that we had a girls' car and a boys' car because we had too many people in the family to go in one vehicle. And so, you know, my phone's connected to the Bluetooth. We're listening to music, having a great time in the girls' car. It's me, my sister, and my niece is in the back, and the phone starts ringing, and it's a Texas phone number. And I'm like, no, no, no, no, and I'm like trying to undo the Bluetooth so I can answer, and it's Ann Romer, so Tamsin, your predecessor, and Reid Wiseman, and you know Reid goes, "Hey, I'm just curious if you still want to be an astronaut." And you know, I reached over and I grabbed my sister's arm, and it was a twin thing. She knew before I said a single word. She knew exactly what was happening, and so you know, we we spend a couple minutes on the phone. They're excited. We're excited, and hang up. And like my sister's crying, I'm crying. You know, grandma's crying in the back, and my poor niece is like, "Why is everybody crying?" They're like, "It's good." You know, so this is a really exciting moment.

And then the boys' car beat us home, so the my nephews came out to greet us and help carry the bags in. And I have this like picture perfect memory of my niece jumped out of the car so fast. By the time I got around, you know the SUV door was opening up, and she runs around and goes, "Auntie's gonna be an astronaut!" and like totally stole my thunder with my nephews. But I could not imagine a better way of doing that. You know, my oldest nephew, who's now 15, he was probably 10 at the time. He jumped so high, I thought he was going to hit his head on that SUV, the back door. You know, I just they were so excited. It was such a it's such a cool moment for for us and for our family.

And you know, I think everybody has a unique story for that phone call when the chief calls to say, like, are you still interested in being an astronaut? And so there are, it's it's hard. It's will not be replaced, is what I will say. That you make some really great friends throughout the interview process. You meet some really like-minded, motivated people who are really great humans. On top of it, so I still keep in touch with some of the people that I interviewed with.

Gary Jordan

Yeah, yeah. Those phone calls. I mean, the astronauts have shared moments of tears and joy and screaming, and you know, like, oh my god, like you know, like just every every emotion in between. So it's just to be a part of that. Right at the end of this this long long process has got to be you know absolutely rewarding, and then you get to bring on a new class.

And I really wanted to get to the the nitty gritty, the process, but really going back to why are we doing this, right? So so so you mentioned this in the beginning. Tamsin is you know we have a lot coming ahead of us, right? And we're seeing it already. You know we're communicating this quite often. We just had the Artemis II mission, so so this should probably be in the back of a lot of people's minds. Is you know the Artemis II mission really is the signal of something that is beginning, right? This is an effort of of Artemis. There's Moon Base. There's all this stuff happening in low Earth orbit. You know, I wonder. I'll start with you, Tamsin. I'm really thinking about. You know, you've been working with the astronaut office comes to you and be like, "Hey, we need to open up applications again. We got this, that, and the other thing." You know, how do you approach how do you approach an application process and really thinking about who are going to be the next people to walk on the Moon? Right. So it's got to be a certain mentality.

Tamsin Abotteen

Sure, absolutely, and it is quite a partnership. I mean, it's looking at "hey, what is the kind of manifest need to be able to accomplish these upcoming missions?" But it's not just about the missions ahead; it's also the type of class that we want to curate and pull together based off of what those mission needs are, but also that we know will make great crew members and great ambassadors for NASA because we have so much going on, and we want to make sure that they are representing us in a way that represents our country, represents our agency well, and is able to accomplish the mission. Not just in getting through it, but getting through it in a way that's going to inspire others across NASA as well as inspire the country and the world. I mean, we definitely have seen that come through in so many of the expeditions through ISS, Nichole's work, as well as we saw that through and through during the Artemis II launch.

I remember whenever I was listening to one of the crew debriefs, the crew saying, "Hey, our goal was to go in as friends and end the mission as friends," and I just thought that was just such a beautiful way to capture the essence of what it means to be great teammates. And that is the type of astronauts we're looking for. They are not only working with each other; they have to be good communicators and good teammates to those across NASA as well. So they're in constant partnership and communication, working hand in hand with our engineers, with flight controllers, with our medical professionals, with HR professionals, and so we want to make sure that we're bringing in great stewards of what it means to represent NASA. So I think that's what we're looking for through this process.

Gary Jordan

I mean, take a look at all the classes that we've that we've had on the the Flies, the Turtles, the the Platypi, Platypuses, whatever… I'll get it one day. I mean, amazing, amazing people. You know, you talk about working well with others and really having a smiling on their face wherever wherever they go, you know, and just being appreciative of all the teams that are are behind, you know, I see it, you know, I sense it, and it's it's it's it can resonate so much more powerfully when you have folks that do that. So so to look for those qualities is all the more important.

Nichole, you experienced this yourself, right? You talk about being on in station 72/73. You were up there for a while. Crew-10, even Dragon, much smaller vehicle to to be with to be with some of your crewmates. What you have to gel with with these folks for long periods of time, right? Kind of thinking about your experience with you know working with others.

Nichole Stilwell

Sure. Yeah. I mean, Tamsin, I love what you said about working with the ground team as well. So I'll hit on that first because I think you know I love to say "space flight is the ultimate team sport." You know, when I go fly an F-22, I look at the maintenance papers and I look at the log and I do the pre flight and I look at the jet and I accept all the risk because I've seen it, right? And you just can't do that with a rocket. It's the engineers and it's the ground team that looks at that rocket, that pre-flights it, that makes sure it's safe, that changes, that catches the things, you know, says, "Hey, I don't think this is right," and then we go change it, and they make it safe for us to fly. And so, it's so important that because we work, we trust them with our lives, and we work with them on a regular basis, you know.

And then you go into space, and you know, take the Artemis II crew as an example, right? We sent humans back to the Moon for the first time in 50 years. And they were in a small tent size for what 10 days. You know, and we're just those missions are just going to continue to get bigger and longer, and we're going to be in small spaces for a long time. And you know, and same goes for the International Space Station. You know, we were on the space station for months. Some people spend a year up there, and you know, everybody's going to have a bad day. And you cannot hide behind a face when you're when it's just four or seven of you in a small space. And so, you know, being able to be vulnerable with your teammates, and then being able to work with each other and pick each other up and move forward and continue to get the mission done is so important on the good days and the bad days, to your point. So yeah, I think teamwork, like I said earlier, is one of the most important parts of what we do, but also of just life in general. And that's what we're looking for.

Gary Jordan

Let's explore that a little more, especially from from a practical sense of what it is that NASA is doing why you know bringing bringing astronauts in for this moment in time. You know we talked about the International Space Station, low Earth orbit. We're definitely still planning on maintaining a presence there. You know space station, but then but then going on beyond space station, right? Commercial destinations. So so there's going to be a lot of new vehicles, a lot of new capabilities, a lot of different what you know, a variety of capabilities. Low Earth orbit, then you have Artemis, and then you have Moon Base. There's these. It's a very broad stretch. You know, there's not. You're not hiring astronauts to do like a singular thing. Is it is you know? Can you bring on can you bring on these folks that really you throw them into a problem and they can solve it. They throw them into a situation and they're prepared for it. Lots of training, lots of vehicles. We're talking human landing systems, commercial crew vehicles, rovers. You name it, right? New spacesuits. So, so there's a lot that's coming.

Nichole, if you don't mind giving us a little preview of some of the some of the things that these the new class of astronauts should be expecting to do.

Nichole Stilwell

Yeah, sure. You know, it's it's an exciting time in human spaceflight. You know, we've got space station alive and well, and we're going to stay there for several more years. We're sending people on commercial crewed vehicles every six months, on Russian Soyuz vehicles every eight months, and then we've got Artemis that's picking up.

We're going to build a lunar base at the South Pole. We're going to try to establish a more permanent presence there. And so, you know, as the commercial companies take over low Earth orbit and continue that effort there, NASA is going to focus on getting to the moon and then eventually onto Mars.

And to your point, we have a lot going on. And there are some things that we need crew perspective on. So we need the astronaut to to get in that suit to to figure out if you can actually bend over and pick up a rock on the moon. You know, we need people to be the Orion commander and pilot. We need people to be the human lander commander and pilot. And those are different jobs and those are different training. And so we, you know, on the International Space Station, when you get there, everyone is a flight engineer, and everyone does the same job, and we can interchange our astronauts easily. But as we get to these more specific missions and these further missions into space, we're going to have more specific jobs that we train to, and so that's what we're looking for in this next class.

Gary Jordan

That's right. Okay, It's going to be interesting to look at all the different astronauts that we have as part of this new class, and really look at what's ahead, what's in store for us. You know, are we picking geologists? Are we picking pilots? Are we picking? You know, of course we're going to pick a little bit of everything, but but it should show you know it's it's definitely exciting.

I can't wait. I want it to happen fast, but I know it's going to take some time. Tamsin, what can we expect for the timeline?

Tamsin Abotteen

Sure, this is quite a thorough process. Usually we expect anywhere from 18 months to 24 months for a typical cycle, but we are going to work really hard to expedite that. Probably closer to the 12 month mark for selection.

So look look for it and make sure to keep your eyes open. If you don't apply, make sure to stay attuned to all what NASA has going on through NASA.gov and the various media opportunities that are out there. That we see our administrator and others alike that have been making sure that people know what's going on with NASA. This is just one of the one of the many exciting things.

Gary Jordan

There's a lot of different parts to NASA too. You know, we're talking about we're talking about, of course, astronauts and and the things that we're going to be doing. We did mention ground teams too, but Tamsin, just to take a nod to your teams, to the to the teams in HR, the unsung heroes really of this process, right? Because I think a lot of folks are going to be focusing on, of course, the astronauts and what's ahead. You know, they're definitely an iconic face for the agency, but really taking a moment to and you described OPM, you described HR, just you know the the expansive team that it takes to to do something like this because you said we're looking at you know September like fallish of next year that's a long time to go through everything just from an announcement to actually you know down selecting working through the interviews it's it's quite a lengthy process so talking about the teams that are making it happen.

Tamsin Abotteen

Sure, absolutely. We make sure that we have HR well ingrained in that process, and that's not just with the astronaut selection process. We also are very involved with all the many of job opportunities that are available across the agency. So, for those that are interested in applying to this position, also consider all the many other opportunities that we have, and that is where we do have our HR team well ingrained in partnering with our management, and leaders, and other offices across NASA to make sure that we are bringing on the best and exceptional talent that we need to accomplish our missions. So thank you.

Gary Jordan

Very good. Absolutely.

Nichole, I'll pass to you for maybe some some final words about you know folks listening to this, maybe pulling some nuggets of oh, what should I put in my resume? Oh, okay. You know, I have until this date. I think it's through December 3rd that they're open, right?

Tamsin Abotteen

That's right.

Gary Jordan

And we should mention this, and because we talked about it ahead of recording this that it is it is at the end of the day Eastern time on on USA Jobs. So if you're applying, it'll be 11:59 p.m. Eastern time, December 3rd. Work your way backwards from there if you're in the United States for across the time zones, make sure you're hitting those milestones. Central time 10:59, you know Mountain Time, 9:59. So making sure that you're meeting that deadline if you really are trying to work on that resume through that through the last minute.

But, Nichole, passing to you for some final thoughts on for those really thinking about how to put this together. You know some some word of advice on the application process, on the interview approach on, you know, in terms of when you get here, the mentality to have, you know, because I'm sure it's very exciting, maybe even overwhelming, but to really come here prepared to take it all on.

Nichole Stilwell

Sure, yeah. I mean, I think it's at the core, it's just be yourself, right? It's tell. Tell us who you are on paper. Tell us what you've done with your life, and you know, no details too small is what I would say. You know, we want to know who you are, and we talked about if you meet the minimum required, it's good. But we want to see the unique part of your your career that shows us teamwork and leadership and operational experience and all of those things, right?

And then if you do get to come and come down an interview. Be yourself. You know it's really tough to put on a face and be disingenuine in an interview. And and it's really easy to see that. You know, we just want you to be yourself. We've got it's it's stressful. It's nerve wracking. You know, I'm pretty sure I sweat through my blazer in the interview. Right, it's only 45 minutes, but I was definitely sweating. Right?

And you know, and we're all humans, and that's that's okay. It's okay to be nervous. It's okay to be. It just means you're human, and it means that you that you care about this. And we want to see that. We want to see the human behind that resume when you come down here for the interviews. Work hard, be a good team player. Like I said, I'm going to preach that, and then we'll see it.

Gary Jordan

I have I have no doubt in my mind that you guys are going to pick some fantastic people. I cannot wait to meet them.

Nichole and Tamsin, thank you so much for coming on Houston We Have a Podcast, showing sharing the nitty gritty of this. These folks are going to be you know they're going to be doing some amazing stuff, even walking on the Moon. Just some fantastic endeavors that we have ahead of us. So let's get some good people. Thank you very much for coming on.

Tamsin Abotteen

Thanks for having us.

Nichole Stilwell

Thank you.

Gary Jordan

Hey! Thanks for sticking around. I had fun with this one. It was a pleasure to have these guests on today.

You can check out the latest from around the agency at NASA.gov. And you can find out more about the astronaut application process at go.nasa.gov/astro2026. That's go.nasa.gov/astro2026, a web page dedicated to showing the astronaut application process.

Applications again are open through December 3rd, 2026, 11:59 p.m. Eastern Time. Make sure you get those applications in in time before they close.

Our full collection of episodes and all the other wonderful NASA podcasts can be found at nasa.gov/podcasts.

On social media we are on the NASA Johnson Space Center pages of Facebook, X, and Instagram. If you have any questions for us or suggestions for future episodes, email us at [email protected]. Thanks again to Paul and Eric for sending in their request for recording this episode.

The interview was recorded on October 20, 2026.

Our producer is Dane Turner. Audio engineers are Will Flato and Daniel Tohill. And our social media is managed by Leah Cheshier and Kelcie Howren. Houston We Have a Podcast was created and is supervised by me, Gary Jordan. Special thanks to Anna Schneider for helping us plan and set up these interviews. And of course, thanks again to Nichole Stillwell and Tamsin Abotteen for taking the time to come on the show.

Give us a rating and feedback on whatever platform you're listening to us on, and tell us what you think of our podcast.

We'll be back next week.

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