Senator Murray Slams Doug Collins Over Staffing Cuts That Hurt Veterans

***WATCH: Senator Murray's full questioning***

Washington, D.C. - Today, at a Senate Veterans' Affairs Committee (SVAC) hearing on the FY27 budget request for the Department of Veterans Affairs (VA)-U.S. Senator Patty Murray (D-WA), Vice Chair of the Senate Appropriations Committee and a former chair and senior member of SVAC, questioned Secretary Doug Collins on VA's decision not to comply with the law and roll out a childcare program, increased wait times at VA, and the electronic health record (EHR) rollout at Mann Grandstaff.

[CHILD CARE CENTERS AT VA]

Senator Murray began by pressing Secretary Collins on VA's acknowledgement that the VA Kids Care program is no longer being implemented, going against the requirement in the Isakson-Roe Veterans Health Care Improvement Act, which authorizedVA's Childcare Assistance Program.

MURRAY: Mr. Secretary, in December of 2020, actually when you were serving in the House, Congress passed the Isakson-Roe Veterans Health Care Improvement Act by unanimous consent. And it was signed into law by President Trump during his first term. Section 5107 of that law says that the secretary shall provide a form of child care assistance by January 5, 2026, to all veterans during their VA appointments.

Last year, your budget requested $22 million to open Kids Care sites at 13 VA medical facilities, and Congress delivered on that request. But you're only planning to use $1 million of those funds in FY26. And this year's budget request has one sentence about the program, which was actually our first notification that the VA Kids Care program is no longer being implemented.

Now VA's own data shows that 58 percent of veterans with children have no-showed or cancelled their appointment, why? Because of lack of child care.

So I wanted to ask you today, what is your plan to restart this program and comply with the law?

COLLINS: I think, Senator, we're fully planning to comply with law. It is sort of obviously [unintelligible] of the previous administration didn't move forward on this. We're trying to move forward with it. Richard can give you some more information on that issue, but this is where it was left with us.

TOPPING: And ma'am, you do know we've got two sites up and running, American Lake and Chillicothe. We are pulling in the utilization demand and outcomes data, so that we can drive this forward. We're looking at reimbursement models as well. As we get the data, we can make the decisions and come back, and that will be in our budget request. But we are moving to implement the law.

MURRAY: Let me be clear-this is a law, it is not a suggestion, it's a law-and we have provided the funding you need to ensure that veterans do have the child care they need to get to their appointments. So I just want you to know I am going to keep-we're going to make sure we fund this program, and I will be following up to make sure that the mandate is followed.

COLLINS: I appreciate it, we agree that this part, again, like I said, this was left for four years, never really done anything with. We're still trying to get it implemented, and we're doing everything we possibly can to do it.

[INCREASING WAIT TIMES FOR VA CARE]

Senator Murray asked Secretary Collins about how VA's dramatic reduction in workforce last year has led to increased wait times for medical appointments, reduced access to specialty and mental healthcare, degraded security at VA medical centers, and created a significant backlog in claims processing.

MURRAY: Moving on. Secretary Collins, last month I had a roundtable with veterans in my home state of Washington. And I heard from a number of them that wait times for behavioral health care can sometimes be up to 90 days. That is 90 days, for behavioral health, unacceptable.

Community care can't be the answer, because it often takes community care providers longer to treat veterans than it would if that veteran remained with the VA. Those same advocates that I met with told me that it can take up to 10 months to fill certain positions. And yet, VA's budget is requesting 6,000 fewer employees than VHA had in 2025.

So I want to hear specifically from you what you're doing to help address this crisis. How many more doctors and nurses has the VA hired since you took over?

COLLINS: Are you talking-okay? There's several questions there. Which one do you want to go with first?

MURRAY: Well you start with where you have an answer?

COLLINS: The I think, let's start off first off at the at the mental health side. There is nothing at this point keeping any of our facilities from hiring the mental health professional that they need. That can be hired at any point, our overall VA wide our mental health appointments have come down. In fact, they have come down two to three days, wherever across the country.

MURRAY: What do you mean come down? Wait times?

COLLINS: I'm sorry.

MURRAY: You're trying to say wait times?

COLLINS: Yes, mental health has improved 2.8 days just this year from 17.8 to 15.

MURRAY: Well let me just tell you, I heard directly from veterans myself and from VA staff. And one VA nurse actually talked to me about how she had 3,200 patients at one point and when she'd get into the office, she said she'd just look at her screen and start crying-because she knew how many veterans were in crisis and needed her. And that's just overwhelming.

So we're in this position because Trump did push out many people-however you're going to characterize it-and now we're having the consequences. And I am told you are holding these clinical positions flat, instead of hiring for providers that our veterans need.

COLLINS: we're not, and I think here's the issue, is that you have a clinical provider that's telling you this, but yet not bringing it up the chain and to the proper areas to actually getting something fixed.

MURRAY: I'm telling it to you.

COLLINS: Well, I appreciate that. But also if you're working in the system and you're listening to this today and you're working in the VA facility that I'm over, and you're not letting your leadership or making sure your leadership is aware that we need certain things. Then I got to have VA employees who are willing to step forward.

MURRAY: Well I'm listening to this woman, I'm pretty sure she was letting everybody know.

COLLINS: Then we will address it and look forward to it. And I look forward to working with you to continue this. I think the biggest issue here though is looking at the facilities, looking at what they need and how we need to go about this.

MURRAY: I just want you to be aware that out in the field, where it counts, mental health is a real crisis, and I am hearing from the VA themselves, I'm hearing from veterans that there's a real crisis in staffing. So-

COLLINS: And I appreciate that, Senator. I'm on the road at least almost two weeks a month, I've been in 71 hospitals, and I go not just for the dog and pony show, I actually go through waiting rooms, I go through patients' rooms, and we talk about this. There are issues. The VA is not perfect, and I told you that the day we had our confirmation hearing, but the one thing is, we can get better and we'll continue to.

MURRAY: Well I have limited time here, I just want you to know you need to be aware that this is a huge problem.

COLLINS: I am aware. Thank you.

[EHR ROLLOUT]

Senator Murray then addressed the failed EHR rollout at Mann Grandstaff VA Medical Center in Spokane, Washington.

MURRAY: Now, let me have one last question. As you know, when the first Trump administration rolled the EHR out in Washington state, it was a disaster.

COLLINS: Yes.

MURRAY: So, I'm really glad to see that the most recent roll outs, as you mentioned a few minutes ago, seem to have gone better.

But I want to, for my own information, when was the last time you spoke directly with providers at Mann Grandstaff?

COLLINS: I have not talked to a provider there recently, no.

MURRAY: Okay, I would like you to, because we cannot ignore the fact that those original sites are still seeing problems and you need to be aware of that. So, as you move forward with the 13 new ones, I want to make sure that the budget supports both deploying to those new sites and making sure that the old ones that have been out there are improving, and I expect and would like to ask for a detailed plan on how you will-

COLLINS: We can. I'll have Dr. Lawrence make sure that he gets you that plan, because we are trying to update the facilities. Look, what happened in Washington state was frankly wrong. It was bad, and you had six facilities that were allowed to act as if they were independent, not connected, and do whatever they wanted to do, and you had subsystem software problems. We've not had that problem, we've fixed that issue moving forward, and we're going to go back and fix those as well. So, I'll get you that information. I agree with you, I agree with you completely.

MURRAY: Alright check back with Mann Grandstaff, because I just have to say I'm excited that you're moving out and not hearing complaints. That's great, but we still have problems at the original site.

COLLINS: And that is what drives me every day to make sure we get it right this time.

MURRAY: Thank you.

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